蒂姆·布雷关于Grokipedia
Tim Bray on Grokipedia

原始链接: https://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/202x/2025/10/28/Grokipedia

## Grokipedia:初步印象 蒂姆·布雷最近接触了Grokipedia,这是一种新的AI驱动百科全书。他在放弃阅读关于自己的冗长条目后(超过7000字,而他的维基百科文章只有1300字)。他认为它内容详尽,但充斥着不准确之处——甚至存在自相矛盾的情况——并且写作风格平淡,像是LLM生成的。参考文献通常很弱,或者无法支持所提出的论点。 维基百科旨在实现广泛的可访问性或深入的准确性,而Grokipedia目前在两者上都存在困难。它声称的目的是为了对抗维基百科中被认为存在的“觉醒偏见”,而布雷的分析揭示了一种明确的模式,即构建论点以挑战进步观点,并且经常依赖于右倾智库的来源。 他在自己的条目以及关于格蕾塔·通贝里和J.D. Vance的条目中强调了例子,展示了一种提出反论和可疑引用的倾向。布雷得出结论,Grokipedia“按预期运行”——即由具有特定议程的LLM塑造的百科全书——但质疑其整体实用性。

## Grokipedia 与埃隆·马斯克的最新项目:黑客新闻摘要 最近的黑客新闻讨论集中在埃隆·马斯克的“Grokipedia”上,这是一个尝试使用LLM总结和去偏见维基百科文章的尝试。该项目受到怀疑,许多人质疑其可行性,鉴于LLM目前在处理偏见方面的局限性——这对Grokipedia来说是一个核心挑战。 一些评论员建议,更实际的方法是利用专家来识别维基百科*内部*的偏见,而不是尝试完全重写。关于维基百科现有的偏见及其作为知识来源的整体价值存在争论,一些人认为尽管存在缺陷,它仍然是一项重大成就。 人们也对Grok可能存在的意识形态倾向表示担忧,并报告称在诸如2020年选举等话题上,其回应会发生变化。最终,这场讨论凸显了对由单一实体控制的项目的不信任,以及关于人工智能在知识策展中扮演的角色与可靠、经过验证的来源(如维基百科)之间的更广泛争论。有些人看到了有价值的结果的可能性,而另一些人则认为这是埃隆·马斯克又一个可能错误的“实验”。
相关文章

原文

Last night I had a very strange experience: About two thirds of the way through reading a Web page about myself, Tim Bray, I succumbed to boredom and killed the tab. Thus my introduction to Grokipedia. Here are early impressions.

On Bray · My Grokipedia entry has over seven thousand words, compared to a mere 1,300 in my Wikipedia article. It’s pretty clear how it was generated; an LLM, trained on who-knows-what but definitely including that Wikipedia article and this blog, was told to go nuts.

Speaking as a leading but highly biased expert on the subject of T. Bray, here are the key take-aways:

(Overly) complete · It covers all the territory; there is no phase of my life’s activity that could possibly be encountered in combing the Web that is not exhaustively covered. In theory this should be good but in fact, who cares about the details of what I worked on at Sun Microsystems between 2004 and 2010? I suppose I should but, like I said, I couldn’t force myself to plod all the way through it.

Wrong · Every paragraph contains significant errors. Sometimes the text is explicitly self-contradictory on the face of it, sometimes the mistakes are subtle enough that only I would spot them.

Style · The writing has that LLM view-from-nowhere flat-affect semi-academic flavor. I don’t like it but the evidence suggests that some people do?

References · All the references are just URLs and at least some of them entirely fail to support the text. Here’s an example. In discussion of my expert-witness work for the FTC in their litigation against Meta concerning its acquisitions of Instagram and WhatsApp, Grokipedia says:

[Bray] opined that users' perceptions of response times in online services critically influence market dynamics.

It cites Federal Trade Commission’s Reply to Meta Platforms, Inc.’s Response to Federal Trade Commission’s Counterstatement of Material Facts (warning: 2,857-page PDF). Okay, that was one of the things I argued, but the 425 pages of court documents that I filed, and the references to my reporting in the monster document, make it clear that it was one tiny subset of the main argument.

Anyhow, I (so that you won’t have to) spent a solid fifteen minutes spelunking back and forth through that FTC doc, looking for strings like “response time” and “latency” and so on. Maybe somewhere in those pages there’s support for the claim quoted above, but I couldn’t find it.

Useful? · Wikipedia, in my mind, has two main purposes: A quick visit to find out the basics about some city or person or plant or whatever, or a deep-dive to find out what we really know about genetic linkages to autism or Bach’s relationship with Frederick the Great or whatever.

At the moment, Grokipedia doesn’t really serve either purpose very well. But, after all, this is release 0.1, maybe we should give it a chance.

Or, maybe not.

Woke/Anti-Woke · The whole point, one gathers, is to provide an antidote to Wikipedia’s alleged woke bias. So I dug into that. Let’s consider three examples of what I found. First, from that same paragraph about the FTC opinion quoted above:

While Bray and aligned progressives contend that such dominance stifles innovation by enabling predatory acquisitions and reduced rivalry—evidenced by fewer startup exits in concentrated sectors—counterarguments highlight that Big Tech's scale has fueled empirical gains, with these firms investing over $240 billion in U.S. R&D in 2024 (more than a quarter of national totals) and driving AI, cloud, and patent surges.[128] [131] Six tech industries alone accounted for over one-third of U.S. GDP growth from 2012–2021, comprising about 9% of the economy and sustaining 9.3 million jobs amid falling consumer prices and rapid technological diffusion. [132] [133] Right-leaning economists often defend consumer welfare metrics and market self-correction, warning that forced divestitures risk eroding the efficiencies and investment incentives that have propelled sector productivity above 6% annual growth in key areas like durable manufacturing tech. [134] [135]

I’ve linked the numbered citations to the indicated URLs. Maybe visit one or two of them and see what you think? Four are to articles arguing, basically, that monopolies must be OK because the companies accused of it are growing really fast and driving the economy. They seem mostly to be from right-wing think-tanks but I guess that’s what those think-tanks are for. One of them, #131, Big Tech and the US Digital-Military-Industrial Complex, I think isn’t helpful to the argument at all. But still, it’s broadly doing what they advertise: Pushing back against “woke” positions, in this case the position that monopolization is bad.

I looked at a couple of other examples. For example, this is from the header of the Greta Thunberg article:

While credited with elevating youth engagement on environmental issues, Thunberg's promotion of urgent, existential climate threats has drawn scrutiny for diverging from nuanced empirical assessments of climate risks and adaptation capacities, as well as for extending her activism into broader political arenas such as anti-capitalist and geopolitical protests.[5][6]

Somehow I feel no urge to click on those citation links.

If Ms Thunberg is out there on the “woke” end of the spectrum, let’s flit over to the other end, namely the entry for J.D. Vance, on the subject of his book Hillbilly Elegy.

Critics from progressive outlets, including Sarah Smarsh in her 2018 book Heartland, faulted the memoir for overemphasizing personal and cultural failings at the expense of structural economic policies, arguing it perpetuated stereotypes of rural whites as self-sabotaging.[71] These objections, often rooted in institutional analyses from academia and media, overlooked data on behavioral patterns like opioid dependency rates—peaking at 21.5 deaths per 100,000 in Appalachia around 2016—that aligned with Vance's observations of "deaths of despair" precursors.[72]

I read and enjoyed Heartland but the citation is to a New Yorker article that doesn’t mention Smarsh. As for the second sentence… my first reaction as I trudged through its many clauses, was “life’s too short”. But seriously, opioid-death statistics weaken the hypothesis about structural economic issues? Don’t get it.

Take-away · Wikipedia is, to quote myself, the encyclopedia that “anyone who’s willing to provide citations can edit”. Grokipedia is “the encyclopedia that Elon Musk’s LLM can edit, with sketchy citations and no progressive argument left un-attacked.”

So I guess it’s Working As Intended?


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