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原始链接: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40038251

本文讨论了更强大、更紧凑的激光器,特别是个人紧凑型固态激光器 (PCSEL) 的进步,以及它们可能对机器人、传感器技术和材料科学等行业产生的潜在影响。 然而,作者对这些激光器何时能够进入小型作坊市场和家庭表示担忧,从而为 DIY 项目和爱好提供负担得起的金属切割。 目前,用于金属切割的激光器需要气体供应等额外设备,以防止飞溅堆积并确保切割干净。 需要大容量空气压缩机或专用气体来有效清理切割区域。 某些金属由于在大气中发生反应而需要特定的气体。 这些因素增加了拥有和操作金属切割激光器的复杂性和成本。 与等离子或氧燃料工艺等现有金属切割方法相比,激光切割零件的精度明显更高。 例如,与等离子切割齿轮相比,激光切割齿轮可以具有更小的节距,从而可以在加工复杂设计时实现连续运动和更高的精度。 此外,由于切割过程中产生的热变形最小,激光切割零件表现出更高的结构完整性。 尽管有这些好处,但人们仍然担心与激光切割相关的副产品排放和潜在危险,特别是在处理有机材料或金属时。 确保正确的废气处理并确保工作空间内持续提供新鲜、干燥的空气对于降低风险至关重要。 更便宜、更强大的激光器的到来为各个领域带来了众多机遇,包括机器人、传感器、执行器、生物技术、人机界面、材料科学、纳米技术和量子技术等技术的整合。 在这些领域结合先进的激光能力可能会带来重大进步,甚至有可能为氢硼聚变等可持续能源生产铺平道路。

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原文


The article rightly points out the industrial impact of more powerful and compact lasers but I cannot wait for those PCSELs to reach the small workshop market. Having a cheap laser able to cut metal at home / small shops would be so useful (And sneakily dangerous as lasers are).


A more powerful laser is only half of the equation for cutting metal effectively.

The laser only melts the metal, it doesn't move it out of the cut, and some metals can react in plain air to sputter back at the emitter optics. Gas is forced under pressure at the cut to clear it. With some metals and/or thinner (speaking from a commercial perspective) stock, you can get away with plain air at high volumes of normal air compressor pressures with good results if it's very clean and dry. Others require specifically reactive or nonreactive gases or blends of gases. That's true for most hot cutting processes though. Plasma usually consumes plain air to blow out the cut, oxy-fuel uses excess oxygen to reactively blow out the cut. Lasers with their extremely narrow kerf are more finicky, which can mean a surprisingly high consumables cost.

More powerful lasers also require the optical hardware to operate in a light vacuum. Plasma generated by dust and air itself will ablate expensive parts. Home shops shouldn't need that much power though. If you're cutting thick or difficult metals regularly, that's not a hobby any more.

Then there's the byproducts. Organics get blasted into all kinds of random organic-ish things that aren't great to ingest or emit at ground level near neighbors (PSA, this is true for current hobby lasers). Cutting metals can get really exciting if you don't clean often and thoroughly enough to prevent a critical mass of finely powdered byproducts. An iron or aluminum fire will wreck your laser. An iron and aluminum fire will wreck your laser, and whatever it's sitting on, and the concrete below that.



Indeed, I feel less worried about my 50w solid state laser cutting head from China than I would a 5w laser pointer, as the 50w laser head has a 5mm focal distance and the head has a 50mm square housing, so it mostly obscures what it is lasing and it defocuses quickly.


> Having a cheap laser able to cut metal at home / small shops would be so useful (And sneakily dangerous as lasers are).

So, please do not come around these lasers with remaining eye unprotected.

I think one should work with these things only using some cameras and never directly.



The quality of the cuts out of a plasma cutter are not great. I always have to spend some time cleaning them up after the fact. I'd hope laser cut parts are much better.


I have a CNC plasma cutter which I use for making robots, and have also worked with laser cut metal. The laser cutter is so, so much more precise. On the plasma I cut some gear teeth with 5mm pitch and they’re okay for a coarse positioning system that doesn’t rotate continuously. On a laser you could cleanly cut 1mm pitch gears for continuous rotation I would think.


Keep in mind that is the constant (average) power. Assuming this is a Q-switched laser with ~10 ns pulse duration, peak power is ~70 kW. (Kind of low as far as lasers go these days, but it's just a laser marker)


> A 5W laser can cut steel

I've experimented with using a 60 W (I think*) laser on a small steel bracket, and even with the beam holding on a single point for a minute, it made a barely visible dot that you couldn't feel by running your finger over.

* It was nearly a decade ago, but I looked up the relevant hacker space and unless they changed the model, it was 60 watts.

The bracket was around 1cm by 5cm, and around 1mm thick.



60w back then would be a CO2 LASER - that's 10600nm and that basically bounces off any non-oxidized metal.

The fiber marking LASERs at work are 1064nm, and at a mere 20w output, will absolutely eat away at steel with no problems.

Edit: I should note there are CO2 metal cutting LASERs, but they are at very, very high output powers to overcome that reflectivity barrier. You need 500w 10600nm to cut through what a 30w 1064nm could cut. My 80w CO2 barely cuts through heavy-duty aluminum foil, and in many spots it isn't a full cut. A 20w marking LASER at 1064 would obliterate the foil.



I'm sorry, but there's no way around it, with 5W you can cut metal just as easily as you can cut a tree with a knife. At least with contemporary technology (In the future who knows).


There are abundant portable galvo head lasers out there. A lot of them targeting the hobby market, but also more powerful ones (that are less cheap) meant for marking or engraving parts in situ.

Everlast now has a laser welder, too.

I think it’s only a matter of time before we get cheaper cutter in the 1kw range.



On that note, did anyone ever make a handheld inkjet or spray nozzle, so you could print graffiti on walls or things on the go? I imagine most of the tech in it would be the same as in the kind of laser device you're asking about.


CNC would be an obvious implementation.

At the moment, there are expensive-but-affordable home CNC laser cutters, typically for a small number of thousand EUR/USD. The more powerful ones can do a very neat job cutting (up to a few mm of) plywood. There are also CNC plasma cutters, which do a good but slightly rough job of cutting sheet metal, and are relatuvely large and complex beasts. I guess a highly-powerful laser, of the type envisioned, would offer the best of all worlds: relatively neat and quick cutting of all materials on the same compact machine.

They might also replace handheld plasma cutters (and welders?) too.



Diode based lasers have driven the cost to laser cut plywood down to affordable levels (~$200 for a creality/comgrow/chinabrand 5w laser). I just bought two of them off ebay as "customer returned" for $75 dollars a piece. they work great on the 1/8in plywood and 3/8in foam i've been cutting. Haven't tried 1/4in ply yet but I bet going slower or multi pass and it will do it.

Edit: It easily cut 1/4 ply (used 2 passes, but judging by the burn marks behind it I only need one). And that's without air assist to clear to the smoke which would help it cut deeper.



Look for "diode laser cnc". If you search for "laser cutter" or "engraver" the results get mixed in with all kinds of larger machines.

The world of home laser apparati is kinda wild.



To my knowledge, you can't really use a laser cutter interchangeably on different materials. Metal cutting is done with fiber lasers, which have very small beam sizes and have a wavelength of about 1 micrometer. However, you can't use them reliably to cut wood, because they penetrate much deeper into it and can burn material below the surface before the surface has vaporized. It also is highly variable in how much gets absorbed, so engraving does not produce consistent results either.

On the other hand, wood cutting is done with CO2 lasers which have a significantly longer wavelength of around 10 micrometers. This wavelength is absorbed very well by wood and most plastics, but is mostly reflected by metals. Additionally, the longer wavelength means that it cannot be focused to as small of a point, which reduces the maximum power.

Chip lasers would still be bound to the same wavelength limitations, so you couldn't cut both materials with the same laser. What you could do, though, is have a machine with two lasers - especially if they are very compact - and select which one to use depending on what material needs to be cut.



Bit of a tangent, but you might have better luck with hardwood vs. plywood. The glue in plywood makes it more difficult for CO2 lasers to cut through. I was super surprised when someone at work mentioned they were able to blow through some hardwood in a single pass but had a struggle to get through plywood.


Yeah, my larger point is that there are already plenty of ways to cut metal in a home workshop.

I don't see how a laser would be an improvement on any of those, unless the goal is to CNC with extremely tight tolerances, but even then... it seems unlikely that you'll be CNCing blocks of metal, more likely just 2D cuts from sheets of metal, which is pretty limiting.

It would certainly be fun for some stuff, but I think the danger level of a super high power laser detracts from the fun.

More powerful cutting lasers would definitely be great for industrial use cases.



I use a 120W laser cutter for practical, precise, CNC projects all the time. I use a lot of 1/4" acrylic because it's a good material for this class of machine, but it's not the best option, structurally. If I could do the same with 1/8" or 1/16" steel, I would likely switch to that for almost every project.

I love the idea of using a mill/router instead, but IMO the more complicated process is fundamentally more dangerous. If a reflected beam can conceivably pierce the enclosure though, hmmm...



The precision of a laser cutter would open up a lot of possibilities. Particularly making things that slot together with tabs - like fabbing my own welding squares and fixtures where a cnc plasma cutter would leave too rough an edge to have them slot together accurately.


Yes, for relatively cheaply. I’m not talking about a 5-axis CNC mill, and I’m not saying it’ll be fast. But a laser cutter is not fast either, and even if lasers get more powerful… a really powerful one is unlikely to be “cheap”.


Yes, and a laser cutter is also a completely different process for completely different things... yet you can still do some of the same things, and a CNC mill would be more appropriate for smooth cuts than a CNC plasma cutter.


Okay, but if you’re expecting a magical new diode laser to cut steel any time soon… good luck. That’s what most of this discussion is about. I think starting with a cheap CNC is more likely to work out.


Actually, wow... the plot thickens. I missed this in my initial read of the article:

> We even used it to cut through steel. As the bright, beautiful beam carved a disc out of a metal plate 100 μm thick, our entire lab huddled around, watching in amazement.

So... it can cut steel! As long as the steel is 100 μm thick. I think that is literally about the thickness of a piece of paper.

This newfound information does not weaken my skepticism about the hobbyist laser mill that can cut through (useful) pieces of steel coming to a garage near you any time soon, unfortunately.



Yes... but you can't buy it. It's in a research lab. And even once it goes into production, what are the odds that it's going to be affordable? They can probably sell every laser they can produce at a very high price for a long time before supply catches up to demand, even though this is supposed to be easy to manufacture.

I'm just extremely skeptical of a steel-cutting laser mill being cheaper than a $10k CNC any time soon. Hardware is hard. Semiconductors are even harder.

As far as I can see, the article provides no indication of when they even hope to bring this product to market, which is never a good sign.

https://xkcd.com/678/

I would love to be wrong.

And really, that video is unsatisfying. They show a mark on the steel, but -- as far as I saw -- they never even show any steel piece that was cut out by the laser. Maybe the steel melts at the very surface... but it may not be possible to cut through a piece of steel unless it is thinner than a piece of paper? We have so little real world information on this laser.



You're right that such things already exist; I think it would offer two incremental improvements:

* for wood, faster and/or thicker cutting, vs. existing CNC laser cutters

* for sheet metal, neater/cleaner cutting (i.e. cleaner cuts, higher tolerances, less subsequent prep-work needed) perhaps in a smaller neater machine, vs. existing CNC plasma cutters.

Especially within the context of a CNC machine, I wouldn't be overly concerned about safety - all of the more powerful CNC laser cutters I'm aware of already come with an exclosure - both for laser safety, and to constrain smoke (before it's vented safely).



Not Poster, but commercially-available solid state lasers top out at a few tens of watts and due to limited wavelengths have restricted usage on certain materials (eg. even different colours of the same type of plastic may or may not cut, well or at all). I know I've a machine in mind that would be great to make if the available diode lasers were able to cut a wider range of materials, never mind metals.

If it can cut metal, it'd probably not suffer much in the way of limitations on other materials... .



I found a 5W CNC laser on sale for a little over $100. It's really fun and useful to cut things out of 2mm wood. Like the sibling says, having the metal cutting version of this at home would be amazing. I have access to one at a shop in the local university that can cut 4-5mm metal - thick enough for a lot of applications.


These lasers mean that the watches that Q gave to James Bond will finally become a reality.

LLMs and self-driving cars mean that KITT from Knight Rider will finally become a reality.

All I need is for Webb to discover a planet a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far, away, and my childhood fictions will have been realised.



Combine these with hydrogen-boron (aneutronic) fusion and we may be able to generate electricity directly without needing a thermal plant. Even though we are years away it still shows a possible path forwards. Here's hoping!


Wikipedia says "... a petawatt-scale laser pulse could launch an 'avalanche' fusion reaction." Quite a lot of zeros to add on to the power.

The article says they are planning 10kW or 10^4W and a petawatt is 10^15W so 11 zeros by my calculation. Could be a while. I think Helion, who are now talking about turning on their fusion to electricity gizmo this summer, may get there first.



> Society 5.0, would see made-on-demand goods

Fans of The Peripheral, I see.

All kidding aside, the sticking point for this, as it already is for high-power LED lighting, is cooling.

It still takes a fairly significant bit of hardware to cool stuff.



This reminds me of the latest ASML machines coordinating UV laser (angle) and diffraction grating to achieve clean small 2D patterns.

I'm curious how hard it is to model light interactions on this scale. What does it take for the authors to come up with modeling solutions for their scaling problems? Is this something one PhD in light physics could do, or do companies and people develop expertise in teams over decades?

It seems like ASML only requires the solution to one wave diffraction interaction (with the mask), but modeling the standing wave and higher-order modes would require much more mathematics. Is it even possible if the solutions for each interaction are probabilistic?

Also, are solutions in practice mostly bounded by the kinds of semiconductor features (holes) they can build?



I wonder if the surface emitting nature of these will make it easier to phase lock multiple chips. This could be very useful for large apertures and power beaming over long distances.

One application for high efficiency large aperture lasers is powering long distance aircraft, either by beaming from ground stations along the way or from laser stations in space. The ability to forego fuel entirely would be quite attractive, allowing potentially unlimited range.



>> make it easier to phase lock multiple chips

Another use for that is holography. If you can make a wafer-scale array of phase locked emitters overlayed with the ability to either attenuate or phase-shift each one, it becomes a nice (one color) holographic display. I'm assuming high divergence from each one.



The article confuses things by comparing PCSELs to edge-emitting lasers, when it appears to be a new refinement on VCSELs, which have been generating large power densities since around the turn of the century.


Is this effectively a force field? Not in a literal sense, just in terms of being able to stop anything airborne practically instantly.

Obviously impossible to defend against weapons like Russia's tsunami-triggering underwater nukes. But seems to rule out anything air-based?



If you look at the document linked at the bottom of the page you shared: https://www8.cao.go.jp/cstp/kihonkeikaku/5basicplan_en.pdf

it mentions the following list of priorities for the plan, and with a bit of creativity it is possible to imagine ways how cheap, powerful, compact lasers could benefit each of them in turn. Probably, and more mundanely, the researchers are doing their best to justify their research grants by connecting the outcomes to the political priorities of the day.

"Hence, Japan will consolidate the following fundamental technologies in particular, which function as core technologies in the real world, for new value creation in individual systems. - Robotics: technology expected to be used in various fields such as communication, social service/work assistance, and manufacturing - Sensor technology: technology that collects information from humans and all kinds of “things” - Actuator technology: technology related to activating mechanism, drive, and control devices in the real world, as well as the results of information processing and analysis obtained in cyberspace - Biotechnology: technology transforming sensor and actuator technologies - Human interface technology: technology using augmented reality, affective engineering, neuroscience, etc. - Material/nanotechnology: technology that leads to differentiated systems through enhanced functionality of various components, such as innovative structural materials and new functional materials - Light/quantum technology: technology that leads to differentiated systems through enhanced functionality of various components, such as innovative measuring techniques, information/energy transfer technology, and processing technology."



A society in which "the average car-buyer" has a tiny portable steel-melting laser is a society where I'm wearing welding goggles every time I leave the house. And I'm not sure how you even lock a bike or a door or a safe any more.


There are already so many ways to defeat locks, that locks are just there to keep honest people honest and to slow down criminals.

The laser in the article took 30 seconds to cut a a tiny disc out of a sheet of steel 100 micrometers thick. That isn’t going to change things on the theft front. There are much more effective methods available today.



> There are already so many ways to defeat locks, that locks are just there to keep honest people honest and to slow down criminals.

If you live at a lower end apartment complex, you might be shocked at how many doors your key will unlock, if you apply a light turning pressure and thrust the key in and out a few times.

I know I was. But it came in handy when one of my xmas gifts had been delivered to the front office, and I needed to pick it up after hours in order to make a redeye flight the next morning. I just used my own room key to open the office (setting off the alarm!), grabbed the package with my name on it, and closed and relocked the door and was gone before anyone investigated.



Yeah, that's exactly it- but the point is I was using an unmodified key.

I've tried this on higher-end tumblers and I could really feel that it wasn't going to work. It's just about the el-cheapo builder-grade locks (which comprise a shocking percentage of home and apartment locks).



When you get down to it, most security measures are ultimately based around creating enough delay that someone can respond with violence.

P.S.: Trying to think of the rare examples that don't qualify, and so far:

1. Direct violent response, e.g. booby-traps.

2. Denial by destroying whatever the attacker wanted, or delaying them enough that time renders it valueless.

3. Denial by making the effort unprofitable, even with no hard time limits.



When I moved to the Netherlands my boss told me to never spend more than 20 euro on a bike because it will get stolen. I didn't listen, and lo and behold two weeks in my 75 euro bike and the 35 euro heavy duty lock disappeared


It seems like that that point the bike thieves are just a bike rental company.

You get the bike for < 20 Euro and then, presumably, at some point in the future it gets stolen again, but you already got 20 Euros worth of use out of it.



Last time I bought a bike for £20 even second-hand, the Euro had not yet been introduced.

Even in 2011, when I made the mistake of spending £90 for a new bike… well, the pedals came off while riding it due to metal fatigue.

Adjusting for inflation*, I'd expect similar build quality from a bike that "only" cost €200 today.

* hard to do when there is also a currency switch, especially when the exchange rate has changed so much



In Belgium, it's a hard to remove sticker on a consistent place with a qr code.

It would take work to remove it cleanly and/or cost money/time to paint over it.

So it's less attractive.

Ps. You'll still need to take care of your 10 k. Bike ofc.

Ps. 2 : engraving isn't done anymore since bike frames got smaller.



The Netherlands famously has more bicycle thefts per year than citizens. At this point you could almost think of cheap commuter bikes as public property.

People in countries where bicycling is not seen as a personality statement generally ride very cheap city bikes around town. Last time I bought one of those in college it cost about 30eur. Is not like in SF where people ride 3000 dollar bikes to work because omg you’re a cyclist now and this is your whole identity.



> The Netherlands famously has more bicycle thefts per year than citizens.

No, it definitely does not!

750k bike thefts for 17.7m people. So roughly one per 25 people...

It famously has more bicycles than people!



Here in the part of Canada I live in, you see some of the $3000 bike identity stuff, but most people ride something in the $500–$750 range. Something practical, comfortable, reliable, etc.

There is also a growing segment of people who use $5,000–$15,000 cargo/kid carrier bikes as replacements for their cars, which is cool. But I do worry about theft of those increasing. Right now I rarely hear of it, but it seems likely to increase. Even the motors and batteries in them cost thousands alone.



I divide locking systems into three classes:

1. Can be opened without tools

2. Can be opened with generic tools (e.g. hammer, hacksaw)

3. Can be opened with specialized tools (e.g. lock picks, liquid nitrogen)



> There are already so many ways to defeat locks, that locks are just there to keep honest people honest and to slow down criminals.

Yeah, I'm currently waiting on parts to replace my door handle. As far as I can tell, the would-be thieves snapped off the handle to make an opening, and used that to cut/snap the rear part of the lock (which normally can't turn because of the lock cylinder) and then substituted in a screwdriver to convince the car that the lock had turned.

Thankfully--and puzzlingly--they were unprepared for the steering-wheel lock and only managed to mangle and bend it (probably with a small bolt-cutter) before they gave up or were spooked off.

'Course, after that they would have still been unable to start the car for other reasons, but it still saved me the cost of fixing a torn-up ignition.



I don't know why you would link a video instead of saying the sentence "chain locks are hard to cut with an angle grinder because the chains are hard to hold steady"


Pfft. I had a medium-grade bike lock in college, and I once accidentally stole a bike because somebody with the same color/model/lock parked in front of the same building as me. My key was a bit stiff and I kind of had to force it, but it worked fine. I just remember thinking "why does this seat feel different?" Took me a couple of days to figure it out. I put it back- sure hope the original owner came and looked again after his initial disappointment that day.


Because of this Switzerland has outlawed portable laser pointers higher than the lowest class.

Anything more powerful than a low end projector pointer is now classified as a weapon and regulated as such.

This at least keeps these units out of the hands of the general public and those that can't use them responsibly.

It sucks for those of us who used them responsibly just like we did with RC aircraft before drones became an item on a discount shelve. However at least I know that if I go to a large event or even a demo I won't be permanently blinded by some idiot.



What keeps someone from driving across the border to acquire one, or ordering on ebay, or getting one at a sketchy shop? "Some idiot" is exactly the kind of person that would ignore the law.

I mean it seems like a fine law, but it's a law so now I never have to think about it again seems strange to me. Running stop signs is outlawed but I still look before I cross the street.



It doesn't stop anyone. But packages are randomly checked and so are cars going over the border.

Same goes for guns. Someone can aquire one illegally but fines are high and there is no impulsive purchase at the next Kiosk so circulation is low and you aren't going to get "lasered" by 20+ green lasers at some event.



An Apple-specific magazine in Brazil made a contest to come up with stickers for the back of the first iPhones. My entry was also an anti-theft device, with the image of a Microsoft Zune.


"The average car-buyer or metalworker" can already afford a $30 cordless angle grinder:

https://www.harborfreight.com/power-tools/grinders/angle-gri...

(Cost plus a $30-$80 battery, of course, but after you pick your color, you've already got batteries). Your locks are far more protected by the social contract that would compel a stranger to stop someone who was cutting a bike lock with an angle grinder, and would cause a thief to fear arrest, prosecution, and jail time, than by actual physical security.

If you want a laser, you can already get a 100W CO2 laser tube for $500:

https://www.amazon.com/Cloudray-W2-Dia-80mm-Engraver/dp/B08G...

It won't do a great job of cutting steel - it will engrave it, but to cut steel you'd need O2 assist gas and a lot more power. It will trivially cut ABS, foam, fabric, wood veneer/thin plywood, cardstock, etc. if attached to a pair of mirrors on an XY stage such as might be borrowed/scaled up from a 3D printer. And, of course, it will trivially scar corneas with the invisible danger of its 10,600 nm laser light. Good news, though - ordinary polycarbonate safety glasses are opaque to the extreme IR light.

Laser safety is serious business, but highly-collimated, tightly-focused laser light is not likely to be produced by a cheap, portable laser. The above tube produces a 100W beam with a diameter of about 8mm. I wouldn't put my eyeball in the path, but a safety shutter can sit in the beam indefinitely and merely get warm. You melt steel by focusing a this 8mm beam down to a infinitesimally tiny spot, and beyond the focal length of your optics it diffuses to something no more dangerous than the source 8mm beam, and beyond that it's no more dangerous than an average lightbulb - albeit one that you have no aversion response/blink reflex to. I always wear my goggles near our cutting lasers, but I know lots of guys who have worked around 20W-20,000W CO2 lasers their entire lives and they're pretty cavalier with regards to laser safety.

Finally, a welding mask is a neutral-density filter, suitable for the (very approximately) black-body radiation produced by a welder, and is much less effective than laser safety goggles at blocking high-intensity light of a very specific color. Depending on the sensor, an auto-darkening mask might not even trigger when exposed to a laser! You'd want a set of 940nm laser safety goggles for this, which is far more exotic and dangerous than a 10um CO2 laser.



Don't cut vinyl with your laser, it will produce chlorine gas which will not be good for you to breathe and will corrode your equipment. Use a dragknife cutter instead.


It does work, and I've got great filtration and ventilation, but yeah, probably not a good idea. Edited. Same caution is true of PVC, which is a shame because it's really convenient for making the aforementioned ventilation systems!


A question I've always had: How do I know if my glasses protect against a particular laser? I'm talking about the ones in hobby CNC machines, laser hair removal places, etc, not high-powered industrial ones, where there's likely a high degree of know-how on safety already?


Best bet is to buy two pairs and stick one in the path of the beam with a sensor or target behind it. Otherwise you're looking up charts for the materials spectral absorption in your lasers emission band


But even if the target isn't cut, that doesn't mean I won't get eye damage, does it? Or do glasses protect even if they're only a bit opaque to the target wavelength?


First of all, I take no responsibility for your safety, I'm just some person on a forum.

That being said, it's all a function of how much light enters your eye. You can look up the exposure limits of the human retina for different frequencies of light to get an idea how little is actually required to damage your eye. The target or sensor should be sensitive enough to react to that much incident light. Just putting something behind the glasses and have it not get cut is definitely not enough to indicate no eye damage.



Proper laser goggles come with ratings. Dependent on the laser wavelength, beamsize, energy/power and pulse duration. Most goggle suppliers will tell you what you need if you supply the laser specs.


A long while ago, I was told that the flight deck crew on Air Force One would wear eyepatches during nuclear drills, so that if (hopefully temporarily) blinded by an airborne nuke, would be able to continue flying after switching the eyepatch to the other eye.


Not at all the same risk profile. Arc welding is just a really bright UV light, and without appropriate protection, it will cause what is essentially a sunburn on the surface of the eye. It is painful, but it usually heals in a couple of days. It shouldn't significantly damage the retina.

Laser light is different: a laser is effectively a point light source, and it will focus inside the eye to a single point with enough brightness to cause a burn. It can cause a permanent blind spot, and damage may happen faster and be less noticeable at first.



yes, but not permanently. You can certainly get dazzled by bright headlights, I can anyway.

but laser light, like staring into the sun, will destroy the delicate structure of your retina, and it doesn't grow back.



> A society in which "the average car-buyer" has a tiny portable steel-melting laser is a society where I'm wearing welding goggles every time I leave the house.

VR-headset will be better, because it can attune brightness and contrast so you can see even at dusk.



This is something that makes me nervous any time I see YouTube videos about these sorts of lasers. They can blind someone nearly instantly, silently, and invisibly from a quarter mile away. That's terrifying.


A BB gun has to be used very intentionally to hurt your eyes. A high-powered laser could blind you because your neighbor is doing some work on his shed and you caught a reflection


BB gun — that's as in "ball bearing" — also known as "airsoft".

In this example, crossfire would require someone to walk into an airsoft combat area without any eye protection and for someone in that game to not realise and shoot them anyway. In the face.

Stray BB bullets don't go very far. They're not rifled, and they have fairly low muzzle energy compared to real weapons — I've shot myself with one at zero range, and even on bare skin it stings rather than penetrates.



A bb gun and an airsoft gun are very different things to me. A bb gun shoots metal balls and airsoft shoots plastic. I would not want to be hit by a bb gun, but an airsoft gun is no big deal (though the snipers can definitely hurt).


Diffuse reflection is only dangerous up to a few feet away. You're neighbor would have to be deliberately aiming the beam at your eye to blind you assuming you're not in the shed with them.


When small organisations get nuclear explosives, the only two safe options are:

1. Spending your life in a nuclear bunker and only interacting via the internet — including pure VR and/or remote controlled robot bodies.

2. Let your government poke around everywhere to make sure nobody is making (or importing) their own nukes, regardless of what anyone says about the 2nd amendment.



This is a terrifying prospect indeed, especially being located in the Netherlands, plenty bikes are getting stolen left and right already.

But I guess this is inevitable, so we'll just have to devise better solutions than the simple locks which in their working principles have not changed in the past 100+ years.

Great market opportunity around the corner I suppose.



Yes, but the average bike thief is looking for an easy steal and will avoid wasting time on a locked bike. Bikes in the Netherlands usually have 2 locks (a wheel lock and an extra chain), so thieves will usually move on from those first. A portable laser might allow a thief to steal even previously safer bikes just because it makes it quicker and silent (I'm assuming both).


It won’t be quicker. The laser in the demonstration was cutting through 100 micrometers of steel.

Cutting through a chain is going to take much much longer. There are already quicker methods to cut or break bike chains and disable locks.

Also cutting with a laser requires very precise alignment with respect to distance. You won’t be free handing this. You’d need to mount it on a device capable of precisely adjusting the distance as you cut deeper into the metal.

Plus it’s relatively easy to engineer laser resistant materials.



Probably not. Heating steel doesn't cut it, it just forms a puddle of molten metal that will cling to the base material. For cutting to work, you need to blow it off somehow.

For plasma and oxy-fuel cutting, the hot gases coming out the nozzle acts as the mass that blows it off. Air carbon arc gouging uses regular compressed air to push the molten material away. I imagine industrial laser cuttings dealing with anything larger then a few millimetres thick would use compressed air as well.

I doubt a smaller more efficient laser is going to change that reality.



It is an interesting problem since the existence of one cutter forces on offense forces all defenders to make substantial changes. I suspect the most expedient way will be to semi-criminalize carry of the devices, similar to spray paint in some places.


Laser handguns are probably never going to be a thing. How many places are there on a human body where a cauterized hole a few mm across will kill or incapacitate someone? How likely is someone going to be to hit those places accurately with a pistol?

There are some interesting niche uses for laser sniper carbines[1], IMO, like punching holes in a gas tank and igniting the vapour, burning out security camera sensors, cutting power/communications lines, starting fires inside distant buildings by firing through windows, etc., but I think most useful laser weapons will be mounted and computer-controlled so that they can track moving targets long enough to do meaningful damage.

[1] It's not a rifle if the bore is smooth.



Can you use this for 3d printin? Like in an array of lasers where every laser is a pixel and you get 3d by shifting a powder layer.

Could this architecture be faster then current 3d printers?



Shrinking things on silicon wafers..

The article explains that it has potential for welding and other commercial applications but it's not quite there yet. It did cut through 100um steel. It's a good read.



What does that have to do with "shrinking thing on silicon wafers" ? This isn't really even new technology. Welding and cutting lasers have been around for a while. Do you think that cutting steel and making CPUs is the same process or that making smaller transistors just needs more power in the laser?


Does it mean someone can take such laser and then go slice people in half?

There is focus on the industry, but surely this should be regulated as it seems to be of dual use.



Neat! That looks like it's weithin an order of magnitude or two of becoming a real ray gun. I hope I can snatch up a few when they hit the consumer market before imdiatly getting banned.


All the handwringing about how horrible bad things will happen when these lasers are out there.....can we please just have a nice, happy, optimistic article about the great future which awaits us??
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